Considering SCAMP

The place to discuss SCAMP (Small Craft Advisor Magazine Project), our 11' 11" micro minicruiser.

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hawk232
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Considering SCAMP

Post by hawk232 »

Hello all,

Thought I might finally sign up and post since I am getting a little more serious.

My background: I'm in my early 30s, pretty mechanical (I race cars and powerboats) and have rebuilt several fiberglass boats from bare hull (actually working on a kevlar raceboat right now). I have decent glass experience and enjoy the process of watching a project take shape.

My sailing experience consists of 4 years ago (to the day, thanks "facebook memories" i bought my first sailboat, an RK20. Long story short, it needed more work than i wanted to give it. Next came a Catalina 22 that i COMPETELY rebuilt. I decided that took to long to rig and needed too much water for where i sail (i got into racing pretty heavily and this boat was decent for that). Then i considered building a SCAMP or buying a sea pearl or a hobie tandem island. I ended up with the tandem island and loved it for a bit. I realized about a year ago that i missed the feeling of an actual boat so i sold that (and the catalina in the same day). I have only had my hobie outback with a sail since march or so.

Now i am considering building a SCAMP again, though much more seriously this time. I have a TON of questions about tools etc. but i know how long winded posts can be and this one is pushing it. I will start simple:

Can scamp be reasonably be built by someone who has never built a boat before?

What is the smallest space that would be reasonable for a build to take place?
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wdscobie
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Re: Considering SCAMP

Post by wdscobie »

My immediate recommendation is purchasing a kit and taking the SCAMP building class. SCAMP is not an 'easy' boat to build. You leave the class with a partially completed hull and having gained much skill.
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jhippe
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Re: Considering SCAMP

Post by jhippe »

I am building from plans. I have all bulkheads cut out and the centerboard initially shaped. I can say that I am thoroughly enjoying the process. I do have some woodworking experience which does help. I have never completed a boat but have started on a couple of different ones. One I switched because it would be a better fit and the second is on hold as I work on SCAMP.

Given your technical background and your accomplishments of rebuilding several fiberglass boats I would say that the SCAMP would probably be within your capabilities. I enjoy fashioning the pieces myself and the flexibility it provides but a kit would certainly simplify the process and take out a potential source of error.

As for space, I am fashioning pieces in my workshop in the basement and will put the boat together in one of the stalls in my garage.
Brent65
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Re: Considering SCAMP

Post by Brent65 »

Hawk232,

I second Dave's advise. I love building Scamp from the kit. I would not want to build this particular boat from plans. It could be done, but not something I would care to pursue.

To me, this boat is not about skill sets, but rather persistence and patience. If you have the standard woodworking tools you'll be fine. One car size space is more than enough room. The other great thing about building a Scamp is all the online community help you get from this forum and the numerous build blogs that have emerged over time. There is a ton of great information and help with regard to this boat.

Finally, If you love seeing things come together, I think you might just love building a Scamp. I'm on my second build and Dave Scobie (Dave, when are you going to build a Scamp?) can tell you how I first lamented the thought of a second build, but I'm so glad I started. I'm having a blast out in my man cave.
Brent Butikofer

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Scamp: Shackleton
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Pocketship:
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hawk232
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Re: Considering SCAMP

Post by hawk232 »

Thanks for the advice everyone. I considered the camp, but i am in florida and cant afford the time off of work both for the class AND the week of driving!!

Brent, I am about halfway through the blog on Hagoth and you actually have a quote that i have sent to some of my skeptical friends about why i am considering another sailboat! The quote was this:
As I sit in my den, looking out toward the South on a cold Idaho blustery February afternoon, my thoughts are with a boat called Scamp. I thought you already built and sold a Scamp, my mind says. Well, yes that’s true…but we’re just being honest and yes, my thoughts are with yet another Scamp. Why another one…I did that once. Well, I guess because I want another one and long to go sailing again. But, wasn’t it sort of a pain in the butt? Yes. Wasn’t it frustrating to show up at the lake and have too much or too little wind? Yes. Wasn’t it frustrating to sort out all the lines and unwrap the lazy jacks from my neck? Yes. So, why do it? Because there is just something about sailing that I can’t seem to shake. It’s more poetry that perfection, more rhythm that efficiency, more authentic than artificial. It’s like stepping back in time 2000 years. A boat you build from your own hand, sail with the wind and howl at the moon. Who doesn’t want to do that? I do. Life is too planned, too stiff, too certain, too predictable. Let’s have some adventure! Let’s build another boat.
hawk232
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Re: Considering SCAMP

Post by hawk232 »

In regards to tools, that was going to be another question. I currently have (in regards to wood working):

jigsaw
circular saw
reciprocating saw
router/table with very basic bit set
cheap stanley chisel set
palm sander
DA sander
possibly a few others...

Things that i plan to aquire (and would welcome any advice on) since, from what i gather, they are just about mandatory:

table saw (looking at a Rigid portable
Shinto rasp
plane (looking at Veritas and hoping to only get away with one (recommendation here as well)??? I was lead to Veritas since i dont have time or desire to hunt down an old stanley and fix it up into a "good" plane. I will often take the time to do such things as it gives me a better understanding, in this instance i will buy my way out lol)
Bchrovers
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Re: Considering SCAMP

Post by Bchrovers »

Hi Hawk232,

Little late to the party so I will try to catch up.

Difficulty, this all depends on personal experience perspective…. I did the class, had woodworking experience, and built from a kit. It was my first build. I did not find the build technically difficult, but it does require a lot of persistence. There are a lot of fillets and parts in a SCAMP. I do not consider it a quick build.

Building from plans, if you have some basic woodworking skills I would not think that would be an issue. But again, lots of pieces so it is going to stretch your build time even longer.

Tools, I think you are right on point. Shinto rasp you mentioned is a must in my book. Another for me is a low angle block plane. I bought the Stanley Sweetheart for $75. I know not the top of the line, but it is 4 and 6 mm okume plywood, and worked great for me. I would add lots of clamps. I used cheap Harbor Freight clamps and they worked fine. Another must for me is battery powered drill. I like the Dewault 12V. Very comfortable to use and not overpowered for the soft wood we are typically using. There are always luxuries that can be added, but I think you have the basics covered.

Where are you at in Florida? I am just south of Sarasota.

Marty
jhippe
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Re: Considering SCAMP

Post by jhippe »

I agree that you are on track with the tools. Use what you have and buy what you need when you need it.

Rehabbing older planes is not terribly difficult but does take time away from the build and there is a learning curve. Veritas planes are very good. I have quite a few and I think that they are a good value. Their low angle block plane is nice to use though it does get a bit tiring using it for larger projects -- here I am thinking about spars, and tiller For that, I would go with their low angle jack plane. This is a very versatile plane that can double as a smoother and a jointer.

One unexpected tool that I am learning to like is my power planer. I use this for hogging off large portions of material such as on shaping the foils. It is definitely not a finesse tool but has saved me quite a bit of time.
Friends with SCAMPS
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Re: Considering SCAMP

Post by Friends with SCAMPS »

I will chime in and question why SCAMP for you? What appeals to you? I ask because there are many many awesome and fun things about SCAMPs, but, speed is not really on the list. It does feel fast for it's size, but, a SCAMP is not a raceboat. I don't want to be discouraging, only questioning.
hawk232
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Re: Considering SCAMP

Post by hawk232 »

I have no shortage of drills (Milwaukee 12v, rigid 18v, Ryobi corded (never gets used so has lasted forever haha) and a old craftsman drill press. I also plan to pick up a few more clamps to add to my collection of 6 or so.

I do plan to shape my own foils. Having done so on my Catalina (granted it was just shaping epoxy) and seeing the difference the NACA profile made over the standard profile, I have to have a NACA shaped foil!!

"Why SCAMP?" is and excellent question and not discouraging at all. I have long held the belief that if I can successfully debate an idea with someone, I must truly believe in it!!

SCAMP has attracted me since its original concept (except the pram bow, which I have grown used to and even embrace now). At that time I thought I needed a bigger boat with a proper cabin (catalina 22). after a few years of trailering an hr away, then setting the boat up for an hr, all just to day sail, I decided I was sick of it. I wanted something that could sail shallow (I live about 10 min away from the gulf of mexico) and setup fast. I was torn between a sea pearl and a hobie tandem island. My wife was more excited about the TI so I bought one. a year later she had gone with me twice! This boat was a lot of fun, was fast and setup quick but it wasn't a "boat". I eventually decided I wanted more of "boat" than a kayak so I sold it thinking I was done with sailing. now, 8 months later I need another sailboat!!! That leaves me between a sea pearl and a SCAMP. SCAMP looks more like a traditional boat than a sea pearl (looks more like an open day sailor) which appeals to me. The tiny size is also appealing (though im not sure why, I have never had a problem handing bigger boats). I have always enjoyed great satisfaction from watching something come back to life, would LOVE to actually CREATE that life for once. I know SCAMP is not "fast" but it sounds like it moves along quite well given its LWL. Light air performance is probably more important to me than all out speed.

All of that being said, I do fear that the simple rig (that makes SCAMP so great) might be a hindrance in practice. I spent ALOT of time learning all sail controls and how to maximize efficiency. These missing controls are part of what led to me selling the TI (only has a sheet).

Marty,

I am in Crystal River, about an hr north of Tampa.
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